GL Golf Suggestions [Mac/iOS Merged]

GL Golf Feedback for the Mac and iPhone
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Post by Jake » Wed Aug 01, 2007 4:32 pm

Thats a good idea, I'm adding it to my list of things to do. It shouldn't be that hard to add in so that if the player chooses anything larger than one, the highscore submission won't be sent. I'll have to make a note so that players know this, but I agree it might be nice to have a few extra mulligan for those games you know your not going to make the highscores list!
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Post by Monkaton » Wed Aug 01, 2007 4:37 pm

jake wrote:Thats a good idea, I'm adding it to my list of things to do. It shouldn't be that hard to add in so that if the player chooses anything larger than one, the highscore submission won't be sent. I'll have to make a note so that players know this, but I agree it might be nice to have a few extra mulligan for those games you know your not going to make the highscores list!
That would be all my games!

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Post by sanmarcos » Sun Oct 21, 2007 3:36 pm

Automatically focus on hole when the ball passes beyond it (i.e without having to press L)

Full screen support.

Internet multi player support.

Anti aliasing support in the UI and game.

Add ambient sounds, birds, wind, etc, and add backgrounds. (i.e woods, beaches, etc)

Fix the focus of the player when starting, i.e so it doesn't automatically focus the hole, but where the actual fairway is (in odd shaped holes)

Tone down the blues in the water and ski to be more realistic.

Add a player along the club.

Enabling dashboard/expose during the game can make it a bit shaky.

Make sure it is Leopard ready. Drop the brushed metal UI and use the new unified look.

Improve the in-game HUD graphics, add a black 1 pixel border to the course outline on the right. Remove the ugly border on the left black information rectangle. Use nicer fonts, try Helvetica, Lucida Grande, something readable. Use different colors. And please use anti-aliasing.


Make the main interface more intuitive, make the ending high score list more intuitive. Mac OS X apps need to have good and simple interfaces.

Make the app remember my name, pick it up from the OS settings. Why does it say (Enter Name Here) everytime, why are there 4 text boxes? there is no "Ok" button or anything. It is counter intuitive.

Otherwise, amazing game. Well worth the 25 dollars, just please, make it more mac like by adding UI quality touches.

Fix resizing so that it updates the screen automatically (at the end of a hole where the user is prompted for a key)

Rename help/feedback to Help, it is the mac way.

Add different types of trees.

Add the effect that happens when the ball hits on the outer edge of the hole, and dances all the way around in a circle and goes out.

Add a tournament mode, so that the user plays against fictional computer users (show a leaderboard after each hole)

Allow normal users to create courses and add a web repository. (This will go well with multiplayer).

Make sure that if you release a new version, you allow all your old faithful users to upgrade at a discounted price.

All of the suggestions above will increase your sales... without a doubt

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Post by Jake » Mon Oct 22, 2007 5:52 pm

Wow, lots of stuff to respond too. I'm adding lots of this stuff to my list of things to add (some should definitely make it into 2.07). Unfortunately that list is big so this stuff might not get done right away, but fortunately I do add most things at some point (look at the change log), and I have some vacation from my internship and school coming up!

•••Automatically focus on hole when the ball passes beyond it (i.e without having to press L)
Good idea, this would make the game flow a bit faster!

•••Full screen support.
Already added in the menu, and if it isn't working try to select one of the preset resolutions.

•••Internet multi player support.
Would be great, but I probably won't have the time to do this anytime soon.

•••Anti aliasing support in the UI and game.
Good idea! When GL Golf started computers weren't fast enough to add this, but now they are. Hopefully I can get an option for 2-8X FSAA added pretty easily, that would make the text/edges look MUCH better.

•••Add ambient sounds, birds, wind, etc, and add backgrounds. (i.e woods, beaches, etc)
I tried this with my other game and it didn't work as well as I wanted, so its low on the priority list. Its still on there, but I have lots of other stuff to do first.

•••Fix the focus of the player when starting, i.e so it doesn't automatically focus the hole, but where the actual fairway is (in odd shaped holes)
This will require going through all 300+ holes and manually setting it up, so I'll add it to my list but I don't know when I'll get to it.


•••Tone down the blues in the water and ski to be more realistic.
OK, I spent a long time trying to get the water to look good but I agree that it can still use a little tweaking.


•••Add a player along the club.
I'm not an artist and my attempts were pretty bad... but maybe I can find someone to do the animations for me.

•••Enabling dashboard/expose during the game can make it a bit shaky.
Can't do anything about this, sorry

•••Make sure it is Leopard ready. Drop the brushed metal UI and use the new unified look.
2.07 will be compiled with Leopard, so I'll take a look at the UI when I get it and try to make it look like the rest of OS X.

•••Improve the in-game HUD graphics, add a black 1 pixel border to the course outline on the right. Remove the ugly border on the left black information rectangle. Use nicer fonts, try Helvetica, Lucida Grande, something readable. Use different colors. And please use anti-aliasing.
I tried to blend the outline on the right so it wouldn't have any sharp edges, but I can see how it looks with one black pixel. I can take a look at different fonts. Anti-aliasing will most likely be done with a full screen anti-aliasing effect so I don't have to re-code everything.

•••Make the main interface more intuitive, make the ending high score list more intuitive. Mac OS X apps need to have good and simple interfaces.
I'm adding more to the highscores soon, so I'll try to fix it up a bit.

•••Make the app remember my name, pick it up from the OS settings. Why does it say (Enter Name Here) everytime, why are there 4 text boxes? there is no "Ok" button or anything. It is counter intuitive.
Good idea, I'll have GL Golf remember the name and grey out the text boxes that aren't used for player 2-4.

•••Otherwise, amazing game. Well worth the 25 dollars, just please, make it more mac like by adding UI quality touches.
Thanks, I'll keep working on it as long as people still have interest in it!

•••Fix resizing so that it updates the screen automatically (at the end of a hole where the user is prompted for a key)
I've never tried to resize the screen after sinking a shot, but your right!

•••Rename help/feedback to Help, it is the mac way.
OK

•••Add different types of trees.
Just did that for 2.06 and the new course. My course maker is going back and remodeling the holes to have the new trees/shrubs.

•••Add the effect that happens when the ball hits on the outer edge of the hole, and dances all the way around in a circle and goes out.
Tried this once and failed, maybe I'll give it another shot!

•••Add a tournament mode, so that the user plays against fictional computer users (show a leaderboard after each hole)
A computer AI is hard to program, so this probably won't get done for a while.

•••Allow normal users to create courses and add a web repository. (This will go well with multiplayer).
The tools to create a hole are very complicated, and require tweaking to get the holes to look good. There is interest in a course editor, so I might get around to programming one some day.


•••Make sure that if you release a new version, you allow all your old faithful users to upgrade at a discounted price.
Old users get all upgrades for free, except the new courses, which require the subscription pack (The next four courses that come out are only $9.95(

•••All of the suggestions above will increase your sales... without a doubt
I agree, I've watched GL Golf increase sales 600% over 3.5 years and 40+ updates!



Thanks for the feedback! Without everyones suggestions GL Golf wouldn't be what it is today!
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Post by sanmarcos » Mon Oct 22, 2007 6:51 pm

Remove the ugly border on the left black information rectangle
That in-game information square, could just be a nice rectangle with AA rounded borders. A simple, black semi transparent HUD with all the information.

Thanks for making updates free, that is great, I am looking forward to new courses. I also love being able to talk to the developer, and you paying so much attention to what the users want. It makes the game even more worth the 25 dollars. :)

On short range, pitch shots, why does the game always choose the sand-wedge?. The soft-pitching wedge is a much better choice.

As far as the animations go (making the clubs more appealing, prettier, adding characters), you should try to hire or ask somebody in the internet, or maybe even somebody in the community to create them. There are a lot of artists that are mac users. Offer a free license or something like that for users that provide royalty free work. Try promoting your software in places like MacApper or MacUpdate promos. (google them)

Another thing, try grouping ALL of the game preferences in a single preferences window. This doesn't have to be a GL in-game window. A normal OS X preference pane will do.

The game welcome screen should be redesigned to be more simpler, and extra, redundant options that most users don't care about should be hidden. I mean: the Play Golf button should be more prominent, add an icon, make it bigger, put it in a spot which has a lot margin around it. The About/Register button should disappear once the user has registered, change it to "Get more courses" or something. Also, most users know that "About" is in GL Golf -> About in the menu, it is a Mac behavior. "Register" should be the name.

The getting started guide: it should appear only once, the first time the user starts the game, and clicks play golf. A black rounded square HUD should appear over the main game screen with instructions. And telling the user to press 'H' to see the help window, where he can read the guide again. Moving the guide to the game itself, for first timers, simplifies the main window UI.

The clubs, mulligan selection should be hidden away in an "extra options", perhaps an in-window drawer (click to expand extra options).

Why are the number of hole selections and ball color selections check-buttons and not drop-down menus?

On the course description, the name and difficulty of the course could be in bold text.

The high-score list provides no notification that it is downloading data from the internet. A nice little spinning grey progress bar (it comes with OS X and is standard) would be nice. So paging. Also, why are is local high score list filled with (Enter name here) even though I have never played?, you should put "No scores yet" or something like that.


When pressing ESC in the game, a pop up window should ask the user if he really wants to quit, save the game, etc. Then return him to the main menu.

Add an automatically check for updates function to the game. See the open source, easy to use Sparkle framework http://sparkle.andymatuschak.org/. Maybe there is one (I see something in version history, but most Mac users are used to Sparkle, it works great).

Why is there a print menu item in the File menu?... I see it does nothing (tried printing to PDF).

The icon needs some work, the edges could be done better, more friendly to the docks transparency. This will become an issue in Leopard, with the 512x512 icons and the more prominent dock.

The hook/slice backspin controllers are not intuitive at all. I see that in practice mode there is a text that displays what I am changing, it would be nice if that was available in the game mode. It would be nice if you explained what hook/slice is for beginners to golf, and also backspin. A couple of in-game tutorials/tips and tricks videos wouldn't hurt. Teaching visually is a great way.

Why does the sand virtually stop the ball in it's tracks.?, a little small roll would be more natural..

It would be nice if the colors of the hole's pole flag changed once in a while (I don't know, maybe thats a rule of golf or something, I don't play it professionally).

It would also be nice if the ball missed the hole by just a inch or two, for the crowd to say "Ohhhhhh".

In the menu, why is there a question mark in "Laugh at poor shots?"

For a future release, being able to save shot replays, making them into quicktime videos.

Finally, see if you can get a copy of Tiger Woods '08, I am sure you will find a lot of inspiration in a surely very polished game. I decided it not to buy it, because it is expensive and based on WINE. I want a truly GL Mac game, that is FUN to play, such as yours. If a game isn't fun, it isn't worth it. Plus, I'd rather support a small independent mac developer such as you. Please keep on working on GL Golf, as you can make it the best native mac Golf game.

I don't know much about marketing, but I do know that your website needs a rework, make it more simple, take hints from Apple's website. Marketing is a huge part of successful software sales. Screenshots and videos matter, it should be feature prominently in your GL Golf home page, as well as the price. Your site has a lot of useless graphics, sharp colors, and is tied down to a very small fixed width UI (it looks bad on the newer widescreen macs).

As a developer I care about OpenGL, and Cocoa, but 90% of users don't know what that is, it is confusing, and it should be hidden away, as Apple does it (in a Tech specs page). Your home-page should be used to showcase all the amazing features of GL Golf, with screenshots. Again, take a hint from what Apple does to market their software.

It would be nice if the game download was one-integrated file, instead of having to download a "registered" version. I do not know of any shareware vendor that does this. It is confusing. If you are worried about size, the extra holes could be downloaded on-demand when the user purchases it. But it should not be a problem, most users have broadband.

By the way, I just payed the 10 bucks for the subscription for new courses. :)

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Post by Jake » Wed Oct 24, 2007 7:56 pm

••• Remove the ugly border on the left black information rectangle
That in-game information square, could just be a nice rectangle with AA rounded borders. A simple, black semi transparent HUD with all the information.
OK I'll give it a try

••• Thanks for making updates free, that is great, I am looking forward to new courses. I also love being able to talk to the developer, and you paying so much attention to what the users want. It makes the game even more worth the 25 dollars.
Your welcome, I like updating the game and making it better for you and the other users!

••• On short range, pitch shots, why does the game always choose the sand-wedge?. The soft-pitching wedge is a much better choice.
GL Golf defaults tries to pick the closest club that will make it to the hole, but I agree that the soft wedge is probably more useful in most cases, so I will switch the default for shots that are <40> About in the menu, it is a Mac behavior. "Register" should be the name.
The menu has gotten cluttered up, I will try to make the important things more prominent. I like the idea of changing the name of the button depending on what has been registered. I will change the About screen to go to the actual about/register screen instead of the default mac os x about screen.

••• The getting started guide: it should appear only once, the first time the user starts the game, and clicks play golf. A black rounded square HUD should appear over the main game screen with instructions. And telling the user to press 'H' to see the help window, where he can read the guide again. Moving the guide to the game itself, for first timers, simplifies the main window UI.
Good point, that will help clear up the main screen. I'll add that to the help screen later, and let new users know to press H for the help screen.

••• The clubs, mulligan selection should be hidden away in an "extra options", perhaps an in-window drawer (click to expand extra options).
That might be a good way to help clean up the main menu

••• Why are the number of hole selections and ball color selections check-buttons and not drop-down menus?
I'm not sure, I'll see how they look as a drop down menu

••• On the course description, the name and difficulty of the course could be in bold text.
Good idea, that should be easy to do.

••• The high-score list provides no notification that it is downloading data from the internet. A nice little spinning grey progress bar (it comes with OS X and is standard) would be nice. So paging. Also, why are is local high score list filled with (Enter name here) even though I have never played?, you should put "No scores yet" or something like that.
Good idea, I'll maybe make a new thread to do the internet highscore and have a little progress bar. I think the (Enter name here) in the local highscores is a bug, it should be something generic like "Nobody, 100, 1/1/1900".

••• When pressing ESC in the game, a pop up window should ask the user if he really wants to quit, save the game, etc. Then return him to the main menu.
Good idea, I'll add it

••• Add an automatically check for updates function to the game. See the open source, easy to use Sparkle framework http://sparkle.andymatuschak.org/. Maybe there is one (I see something in version history, but most Mac users are used to Sparkle, it works great).
That looks very interesting and would simplify the process, I'll look into it some more!

••• Why is there a print menu item in the File menu?... I see it does nothing (tried printing to PDF).
Printing works for me, what version of OS X are you running?

••• The icon needs some work, the edges could be done better, more friendly to the docks transparency. This will become an issue in Leopard, with the 512x512 icons and the more prominent dock.
I'll smooth everything out when leopard comes out, I have 50 or so items in my dock so I never noticed.

••• The hook/slice backspin controllers are not intuitive at all. I see that in practice mode there is a text that displays what I am changing, it would be nice if that was available in the game mode. It would be nice if you explained what hook/slice is for beginners to golf, and also backspin. A couple of in-game tutorials/tips and tricks videos wouldn't hurt. Teaching visually is a great way.
Good idea, I think displaying that information would be good as well as giving the users more of a tutorial.

••• Why does the sand virtually stop the ball in it's tracks.?, a little small roll would be more natural..
Good idea, that could make the game more realistic if I could tweak the sand to behave more like real sand.

••• It would be nice if the colors of the hole's pole flag changed once in a while (I don't know, maybe thats a rule of golf or something, I don't play it professionally).
OK, I'll see about changing them and maybe adding hole numbers to the flags.

••• It would also be nice if the ball missed the hole by just a inch or two, for the crowd to say "Ohhhhhh".
Good idea, this should be easy to add. Maybe if the users shoots from > 25 yards away and comes within a few feet.

••• In the menu, why is there a question mark in "Laugh at poor shots?"
Not sure, but its gone now :)

••• For a future release, being able to save shot replays, making them into quicktime videos.
Not sure about making them into quicktime videos, but I probably could add the option to save replays. Right now I have some weird bug where replays don't always work correctly, and its driving me crazy! Once thats figured out I'll add saving replays.

••• Finally, see if you can get a copy of Tiger Woods '08, I am sure you will find a lot of inspiration in a surely very polished game. I decided it not to buy it, because it is expensive and based on WINE. I want a truly GL Mac game, that is FUN to play, such as yours. If a game isn't fun, it isn't worth it. Plus, I'd rather support a small independent mac developer such as you. Please keep on working on GL Golf, as you can make it the best native mac Golf game.
Good idea, I do get inspired when playing good golf games! I heard the version for the Wii isn't that great, so hopefully I can get a 360 this christmas (maybe that could be a legitimate business expense... but maybe not). Thanks for the support, if it wasn't for people like you GL Golf would be nowhere!

••• I don't know much about marketing, but I do know that your website needs a rework, make it more simple, take hints from Apple's website. Marketing is a huge part of successful software sales. Screenshots and videos matter, it should be feature prominently in your GL Golf home page, as well as the price. Your site has a lot of useless graphics, sharp colors, and is tied down to a very small fixed width UI (it looks bad on the newer widescreen macs).
I agree the site could use updating. I won a free template years ago, but maybe its time for someone else to redo it. Fortunately most people get my games from other sites and never actually hit my site, they just go directly to Plimus.com to purchase.

••• As a developer I care about OpenGL, and Cocoa, but 90% of users don't know what that is, it is confusing, and it should be hidden away, as Apple does it (in a Tech specs page). Your home-page should be used to showcase all the amazing features of GL Golf, with screenshots. Again, take a hint from what Apple does to market their software.
Good point.

••• It would be nice if the game download was one-integrated file, instead of having to download a "registered" version. I do not know of any shareware vendor that does this. It is confusing. If you are worried about size, the extra holes could be downloaded on-demand when the user purchases it. But it should not be a problem, most users have broadband.
I did this before, but when the registered version became around 10MB I separated them. I noticed a BIG increase of sales because people are more willing to download a 3MB file than a 25MB file, and a larger percentage of users actually finish downloading the 3MB file than the 25MB file. I don't think there is any chance of changing this for several years.

••• By the way, I just payed the 10 bucks for the subscription for new courses.
Thanks, I hope you enjoy the courses!


Thanks for all of the support and tips. I won't have a chance to get to all of them in the very near future, but lots of them will get taken care of in the next 6-12 months.
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Preference for size of minimap?

Post by Sapphie » Sun Nov 18, 2007 9:00 am

Would be good to be able to double the size of the minimap?

Thanks
Lee

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Post by Jake » Sun Nov 18, 2007 9:42 am

Does anybody else have an opinion about doubling the size?
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Post by Sapphie » Sun Nov 18, 2007 5:05 pm

Jake,

I'd also like to be able to control the text colour. I find the red very 'glary' - don't know why, could be my partial colour-blindness!

Lee

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Post by Jake » Sun Nov 18, 2007 10:18 pm

I'll add that to the never ending list also, I want to redo the whole text system at some point.
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Course Designs

Post by Oz » Fri Dec 14, 2007 6:51 pm

Jake,

Great game, and thanks for the continuous updates and improvements. I really enjoy the unconventional courses like Rocky Grove and the Isle courses. I'm not saying turn it into a putt-putt adventure, but the holes with cliffs, large slopes and vertical changes, and multiple "paths" to the green are a lot of fun. Keep those coming.

Maybe add the effect of sloping terrain on the trajectory of the ball (i.e. downhill lie, lower trajectory; sloping down to the left, ball tends to go left, etc.) That would definitely add strategy to how some of the holes are played.

And if you ever add a course editor where users can modify or build their own courses... never mind, I'd spend too much time at the computer.

Oz

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Post by Jake » Sat Dec 15, 2007 9:13 am

Thanks for the feedback Oz! I'm glad you enjoy these courses, they aren't the most popular in terms of games played but I really enjoy playing them too. One of the next upcoming courses is going to make use of steep terrain and hills, so it should be very challenging without making the game "unrealistic" like the isle courses.

I'll add your suggestion to my list, it sounds interesting! Unfortunately there is no course editor now and its all done in photoshop plus some custom programs I wrote, but if there ever is one I'll make sure to release it!

Jake
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Suggestion

Post by DaveR » Thu Dec 20, 2007 9:27 am

I've only been a registered user of GLGolf for a couple weeks, but I'm enjoying the simplicity and fast gameplay. The only minor issue I have with it is the readability of the red shot info text in the bottom left corner. Perhaps there could be an option to change the text color.

Just a thought. Keep up the good work!

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Post by Jake » Thu Dec 20, 2007 9:30 am

Thanks I'll move that up on my priority list, unfortunately I'm swamped with school right now so it might take a few updates to finally add it.
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Lighting Effects

Post by Sapphie » Mon Jan 07, 2008 9:46 am

Hi Jake

Game gets better all the time and I like the nice subtle lighting, especially when playing in 'winter' mode.

I had an idea for a 'sunset' ... wouldn't it be great, especially for the courses near the sea, for us to be able choose a 'time of day' as well as a season, e.g. 'evening' ... and for the game to make to sky go nice and red as sunset approaches!!

Lee

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Post by Jake » Mon Jan 07, 2008 4:49 pm

Good idea! Right now I'm working on the spring/fall season, but the lighting/time of day idea sounds awesome too! This probably won't be looked at for a few months but I'm pretty excited to try that
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Post by Sapphie » Wed Jan 09, 2008 4:24 am

Jake

Whilst trying the new course in 2.09 beta, I ended up in the trees quite a lot! I realised, almost be accident, that I coudl quickly get a better view of where I was by right-clicking the mouse and turning the view. Great! I hadn't thought of doing that before.

Then I go to thinking ... what about the idea of having an optional 'overhead view' - sort of like the minimap I guess but occupying the whole screen. That would enable us to see more clearly where we are. You could have a hot key to switch plan view on or off, and whilst it was on even allow us to hit the ball whilst in that view.


Of course I have no idea how difficult this would be to add but what do you think?

Lee

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Post by Jake » Thu Jan 10, 2008 3:08 pm

Great idea, its pretty easy for me to add more views, right now there are three additional views using the x,c,v keys. I should be able to add this at some point.
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Sapphie
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Post by Sapphie » Fri Jan 11, 2008 4:28 am

Jake

I often play a 2-player game with my partner; unfortunately she usually beats me! That aside, I have been meaning to ask about the order in which players have their turn. I don't really know what the 'official rules' are but I wonder if you could implement an option 'alternate turns when teeing off from a hole'? It's just that at the moment, whoever goes first for the first hole ends up going first for most of them on a given course and it would be nice to have the option to strictly alternate.

One other thing - some courses are 9, others 18 ... could that be listed in brackets next to the course name in the list e.g

St Andrews Jubilee (18)
Snowflake Ridge (9)

or perhaps order the list as follows:

18 hole Courses
...
...
St Andrews Jubilee

9 Hole Courses
...
...
Snowflake Ridge

Special Courses
eg the random ones etc

Just an idea

Lee

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Jake
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Post by Jake » Fri Jan 11, 2008 10:16 am

Thanks for the suggestions! Actually someone sent me a very similar email about the order of play for multiplayer games. I've almost completed adding "honors" to multiplayer games, where the player who did the best on the previous hole has to hit first on the next hole. If there is a tie then it goes back to the second previous hole, ect. I may add the alternate turns in the future, but I'm sure the game will at least use honors in 2.10

Great idea about organization of the courses, that will definitely be done for 2.10

I think I'm going to send out the 2.09 update today at my 1:00 break so I can really get cracking on 2.10.
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GL Golf - Pinball Massacre - Barnyard Blaster - Rocket Golf - Liquid Defense - Hydrothermal

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